Anna Is Italy’s ‘Real Baddie’ of Hip-Hop

A few nights ago, while I was driving home, the shuffle chose “BBE” by Anna and Lazza. The chorus is one of those that immediately get stuck in your mind, the lyrics are a statement of empowerment, a sort of manifesto of a strong and determined girl who never has to ask.

In the time I spend with her for the interview I discover two things in particular. The first is that behind that tough image there is a very sweet girl in her early twenties who, overwhelmed by a success that has taken away a piece of her adolescence, sometimes dreams of exchanging her famous life for a normal one for one day, like any of her peers. The second is that also “real bad bitches cry,” as she raps in “Una Tipa Come Me,” undoubtedly the best of the 18 tracks on Vera Baddie, her debut album, released on June 28.

It’s strange to think that it is only her first album, given that from 2020 to today – between singles with tens of millions of streams and collaborations with the heavyweights of the Italian rap scene – the rapper has constantly dominated the Italian charts and in 2023 was the most listened to female artist in Italy. But she wanted to do things well and in her own way, taking the time necessary to mature and make a project that wasn’t something ephemeral but that will make her proud when she listens to it again in ten years.

After having met the “Real Baddie,” in this interview we discover the real Anna: from the fragility of her twenties to the desire for sincere human relationships, from the most important goal she has achieved to music as therapy to exorcise anxiety, from the little girl she was to the woman she is now.

Anyone who listens to this album will be amazed at how you opened up about your fragilities, something you hadn’t done yet.

I think so, too. I hadn’t dug into myself yet. It took me time to do it. For me it’s much easier to make a song to entertain and have fun rather than delve into the things that hurt me, into my relationships with people. This album unlocked me from this point of view.

Was there something that made you realize that you were ready to show a different side of yourself?

Certainly the fact that many girls told me that they see themselves in me made me feel the need to explore other sides of being a girl today. I wanted to address more facets of this thing, even the negative ones. I’m proud to have brought out another part of me and I’ve matured a lot as a person to be able to do this, to unite my feelings with music.

The album arrives four years after your first singles. In an interview you said that you didn’t want to become famous as it happened but to work your way up. Did taking time also help you sort out what was happening in your life?

Yes, it took me a few years to stabilize my life, also because success came when I was still very young, in a particular moment like quarantine. These four years also helped me grow as an artist. I feel like I’ve really raised the bar in my songs. I want my name to have a certain value and depth, and that it be understood that I take music seriously, because it is what I live for.

Can we say that this has nothing to do with being a woman in a male-dominated world?

Absolutely yes! I’m here because I’ve never felt a difference between me and my male colleagues. The more this is emphasized, the more girls feel discouraged from being rappers. When they say that I’m the best in Italy I would respond: “I’m not the best, I’m simply the only one who let herself go and who never gave a damn about being a woman among only men. Even at the cost of receiving insults.” I didn’t bring “female rap,” I brought my music, period.

If female rap existed, male rap should also exist…

Right! Do you know how many times I get told that I am proof that women can rap too? Rap is rap, period. There is no gender, the important thing is to do it well. Many times, girls feel disadvantaged because they don’t feel supported, but when I started, who supported me? Nobody. It was me, alone. Little by little I built my own path and asserted myself.

The concept of “baddie” means more than it seems, right?

Being a baddie doesn’t just mean being a girl who has fun: the baddie is the one who transmits determination to other girls, who helps them in times of need. Girls understood this, and that’s enough for me.

You said you suffered a lot from criticism in the past. Now that you’ve grown up, how do you deal with this?

I have a lot less hating than before because people have gotten to know me. They see me in concert and appreciate the person I am. Over time I learned not to care. Bad things no longer affect me as they used to because I take them as something negative towards those who say them, not towards me who receive them.

You also said that the criticism had tripled the moment you exploded, so much so that the internet had given an image of you that didn’t correspond to the real one. Were you ever afraid that after your debut single “Bando” everything could end?

More than anything, people put the fear in me. I knew very well what I wanted to do in life, but many people can’t wait to destroy you. I remember when they told me: “In a month she will already be gone.” But damn it, I’m still here, and I’m here because I have a lot to give, because I’ve always been convinced about this, because I felt that this was my path.

I often see videos of you with your fans and you still seem like a very humble girl.

I think this has a lot to do with the fact that I haven’t enjoyed a normal life. From the age of 16 onwards, all the things I did were inherent to my job. So outside of that I want to be as normal as possible and enjoy life. My simplicity is not to do others a favor or to make me say, “Oh, look how humble Anna is.” I love being like this, I love having a normal chat with someone, why should I be a snob?

Is the fact of including so many references to your adolescence in the album also a way to recover a moment of your life that you didn’t experience as you wanted?

Maybe. Often at night I dream of my old school, my old classmates, the environment I frequented before. I miss those things because I haven’t enjoyed them at all. I’m not even someone who has made many friends in an organic way in life because I haven’t had the time or the way to do it. I suffered a lot for this. Young girls often tell me that they envy my life, but I envy theirs and they don’t even imagine it.

For this album you also worked in the U.S. and one could tell it. It’s a very international sound.

Yes, for example I wrote “Una Tipa Come Me” there, but most of the songs were born in my bedroom at home. In my head there is no such thing as having someone write something to me. If I make songs, it is to say something, and that must come from me. I could never get other people to put their words in my mouth. Music for me is such an intimate and personal thing that I couldn’t let someone change it. It bothers me when they say: “Oh, Anna has improved, I wonder who writes her lyrics.” Well, nobody!

In your producers, however, you have complete trust.

Absolutely. They are fundamental, without them this album wouldn’t be what it is. I do my thing, I write the lyrics, but if there isn’t a good backing track none of this is possible. I’m happy that such fresh and cool young people are finally making their way in Italy.

Earlier you mentioned “Una Tipa Come Me,” which for me is one of the songs that will most surprise those who listen to the album.

Yes, it’s definitely the most introspective song on the entire album. I had started working on it in the studio with an American producer while I was in the USA, but I was too tense and couldn’t finish it, so I picked it up again while I was alone in my room. Last summer was a bit of a tough time for me. I lost a lot of kilos due to stress. I had a very fluctuating mood and therefore I needed to throw these feelings out and talk even more about myself, about my character. It freed me a lot.

In the intro you say: “Doing this stuff helps more than a psychologist.”

For me music has always been a cure. I suffer a lot from anxiety which also manifests itself in a psychosomatic way, and when I feel like I’m starting to feel bad I put on my headphones, listen to music and I swear I feel better. It’s really my therapy, my life revolves around music.

We talked about criticism. Can you tell me what is the nicest thing a fan has said to you?

It makes me proud that many girls tell me that I give them the determination to face everyday life and the dark times. Once a girl wrote to me that her dad had had a heart attack, and listening to my music relieved her. For me it was a wonderful thing to know that I was making life a little less burdensome for a person who was going through a difficult time.

What is the most important milestone you have achieved so far?

From a personal point of view, it would be being able to help my mother have financial stability. I have always seen her work hard, so allowing her to no longer work and giving her a serenity that she never had is the greatest joy. For me, the relationship with my parents is everything: when they are well and have no worries, life changes you completely. In terms of career, however, I would say working with Sfera Ebbasta. When I was a young girl it would have seemed impossible, but in a few days I will be singing at the San Siro stadium in Milan with him. If I had told this to my past self, she would probably never have believed it!

And what would younger Anna say to Anna today?

She would say that she’s proud of who she has become because that is exactly who she always wanted to be. If Anna as a child could travel in time and see me now, she would get excited, she would say that I’m really cool, that she got to where she is on her own and because she believed in it so much. Well, perhaps the greatest achievement is simply being me.